PPS: Please at least TRY to read the following (if possible, not just the title) with an open mind and in a spirit of tolerance. It was written in good faith by a Linux user who will be staying on Linux.

PPPS: Among all the mean-spirited downvoting and insults and calumny (hey, this is social media) I actually learned a few useful things from this discussion. Perhaps the highlight was the tip about an obscure crowdfunded project which really fits the bill. Too late this time but I’m hopeful such projects, including Pine and Framework, might be become more available and more affordable in future.

PPPPS: I do not reply to downvoters (after all, you’re declaring you don’t care what I have to say). Or to people who obviously have not read beyond the title. Sorry. My post is very clear and I cannot express what I wrote better. In summary: There is a worsening problem with Linux compatibility on low-end hardware, due to the decline of desktop computing and in particular to the insurgency of ARM and Mediatek. It may hurt to hear it but it’s true and we should care about it. Thanks to those who offered constructive feedback.

I’m frustrated. Once again, I have had to buy a computer I didn’t want in order to stay on Linux.

Some background. Compared to most people in this forum, I am a somewhat normal computer user. That is, I have not touched a mouse in decades, I use a small lightweight low-end laptop (which is not slow on Linux), and I do not take anything to pieces. To be clear, I’m a programmer and a massive FOSS idealist. But I’ve never been interested in hardware, and in this respect I’m a complete normie. Let’s not forget that for most ordinary people, a “computer” these days is the tethered corporate toy in their pocket.

For me this slide away from free personal computing is now getting impossible to ignore.

  • 20 years ago I could buy a laptop (a Fujitsu) from a major European electronics retailer which came with a Linux CD - a Linux CD! (Kanotix, a Debian variant).
  • In the late 2010s, I had a nice choice of cheap Taiwanese Wintel netbooks. So there was a Windows tax to pay but at least the hardware worked fine.
  • 4 years ago, the options were getting thin on the ground. For 400€ I could find only one Linux-compatible X86 laptop, made by Acer. And since I didn’t have a Linux live USB, I had to (fake-) register the thing with Microsoft in order to get access to the damn web.
  • Today, there’s almost nothing left. Intel laptops have all but disappeared from the budget aisle, replaced by ARM-powered Chromebooks and, increasingly, big Android tablets with keyboards. Putting non-spyware Linux on these things is often possible, sort of, but it’s a nightmare. You’re back to the 2010 era of ROM-flashing on Android, using repos from random developers and wading through impenetrable forum discussions. It’s a massive PITA. This is not the way computing should be done, and normal users will never do it even if they were capable. It’s hardly secure either.

The geeky suggestion which I can hear coming, “buy a secondhand Thinkpad”, is not a proper solution. It’s a band-aid fix with a timeout (PS: meaning it’s on the way to EOL). Hardware from the likes of Tuxedo and Framework is nice but too heavy (PS: correction, Framework is not heavy) and way too expensive for me. The Pinebook Pro is always out of stock.

And anyway, for years I have wanted to move from a laptop to a convertible tablet (like the Surface or Lenovo’s Yoga and Duet lines) (PS: meaning the form factor pioneered by those models, the cheap options these days are invariably on ARM). It makes so much sense ergonomically and even in terms of maintenance. (Keyboards have moving parts. I have to change my Acer because it has a faulty keyboard which cannot be fixed except professionally at prohibitive cost. Crazy.) But none of these computers are easily compatible with Linux. It’s possible, yes, but hardly simple.

I considered, for a fleeting moment, throwing in the towel. After 20 years.

And then bought yet another laptop, basically the same model as last time except a Chromebook. I know I’ll get an OS I control onto it without too much stress. That’s a relief. But I’m more worried than ever about how this story is going to end.

PS: I should have predicted the bitterness and negativity and cynicism I would provoke simply by sharing my thoughts and feelings in good faith. Social media is absolutely incorrigible. In the meantime I will of course be staying on Linux, as I thought I described.

  • Diplomjodler@lemmy.world
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    4 months ago

    I’m not really sure what you’re complaining about here. Laptops are too expensive? Yeah, so is everything else. That has nothing to do with Linux. And why would buying a second hand machine be a temporary solution? Laptops are always being phased out and flogged off for cheap. And you can run Linux on pretty much any x86 machine, now and in the foreseeable future.

    • JubilantJaguar@lemmy.worldOP
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      4 months ago

      At this rate there won’t be any left. Did you read what I wrote closely, or just the vibes part?

      PS: to be clear, literally all your questions are answered in my post.

      • sorghum@sh.itjust.works
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        4 months ago

        So long as there are businesses needing laptops and on regular upgrade cycles, I would believe there will still be surplus for us. Let someone else pay the new car tax. I’m buying used until prices improve.

        I have used ThinkCentres for a router and Nextcloud setup, a year behind refurb ThinkPad for mobile work, and server parts deal hard drives in my NAS.

        • JubilantJaguar@lemmy.worldOP
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          4 months ago

          As hinted, what I’m looking for is smaller, lighter, fanless, basically a glorified tablet. What lives in the niche occupied by netbooks a decade ago. There are more and more options. But this time the hardware is all but incompatible with Linux.

          For slightly more serious hardware your plan is decent. Pretty green too.

  • dhtseany@lemmy.ml
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    4 months ago

    After 20 years. [Of using Linux] But none of these computers are easily compatible with Linux. It’s possible, yes, but hardly simple.

    What Linux distro are you using in 2026 that still struggles with hardware driver support for mainline systems from a manufacturer you’ve heard of? Most driver hardship these days stems from putting Linux on locked down or uncommon/ niche hardware. Basically any system you’ve listed will do fine without tinkering, pick the system you want with the features you need, buy it, then install Linux. I bet most things just work out of the box.

    • JubilantJaguar@lemmy.worldOP
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      4 months ago

      Please re-read the paragraph where I describe what is available, on the shelf, in an the same affordable price bracket, now compared to 20 years ago.

      PS: inane toxic downvoting does not make facts disappear. My observation was pretty watertight: in the low-end hardware niche, Linux is now significantly less well supported than a decade ago. That should be a problem for everyone here.

      • Specter@piefed.social
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        4 months ago

        You post is long but is not very clear, the commenter above is correct. What exactly is your grievance? That Linux does not support your ancient laptop? Or it does not support the laptops (let’s face it, tablets) that YOU want?

        Unfortunately resources are scarce in the Linux community, so labor needs to be allocated where most people are (AKA using hardware from the last ~5-10 years, not 30). And Windows surface tablets are extremely locked down.

        I’m sorry that you can’t find people who want to continue supporting hardware so old people get nostalgia when they hear its name (eg. Pentium i586). It seems to me you’re not willing to do it either.

        Ultimately you’re reducing to hardware a phenomenon that also involves software. Realistically who can run modern computing operations (such as web browsering) on a laptop with 3-4 GB RAM? The answer is nobody. Not comfortably, at least. Browsers take easily 3GB of RAM with just a few tabs open.

        As for all laptops being bulky… this is the consumer preference. I don’t like it either but we can barely fault manufacturers for producing what consumers want to buy. I see this trend on phones as well, for me smaller phones are the best thing but the market moved towards bigger screens, heavier phones. And you want underpowered devices? If you could have a slim and lightweight laptop/tablet, wouldn’t you want it to be as powerful as possible? This doesn’t make any sense from a consumer perspective.

        Lastly, if you want whatever machine you buy to last longer, then ironically you should learn a thing or two about hardware so that you can replace parts yourself. You don’t have to become a genius, just follow some steps on YouTube on how to change RAM, add SSDs… and yes, Thinkpads especially older ones are great for this since many parts are non-soldered. Apparently this year they are also launching a new one that is way easier to open up and replace parts with their removable keyboard.

    • JubilantJaguar@lemmy.worldOP
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      4 months ago

      Yes, for 1000€-plus. A decade ago you could go to a big-box store and get a Linux-compatible computer for a fraction of that. Today you cannot.

  • PetteriPano@lemmy.world
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    4 months ago

    400€ in 2006-money is 600€ today. Starlabs used to have a cheap model, but I guess it’s hard for anyone to be in the budget segment with RAM prices these days. I bought a huawei matebook a few years back for about 600€ - they’re sold with Linux pre-installed in China, but not here. But that means that stuff is well-supported.

    In my mind the landscape is quite a bit better than 20 years ago. You’d have to pick and choose a model that worked well then. Chipsets are usually well supported by the time they are in laptops today.

    The Microsoft tax has been under pretty heavy NDAs lately, but it wouldn’t surprise me if M$ were paying to be pre-installed. They’re in the data mining business, not operating systems in 2026.

    But yes, we’re all still waiting for the year of the Linux desktop.

    • JubilantJaguar@lemmy.worldOP
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      4 months ago

      Chipsets are usually well supported by the time they are in laptops today.

      I don’t get where you’re coming from, unless you’re talking exclusively about expensive, heavy, Intel-powered laptops. The cheaper ones are now moving en-masse to ARM and Mediatek, along with the convertible tablets that are replacing them. All this stuff (and there’s lots of it) is all but incompatible with Linux.

  • frongt@lemmy.zip
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    4 months ago

    I don’t understand. First, usually laptop keyboards are pretty easily replaceable, there should be teardown videos for just about anything on YouTube. You shouldn’t need to pay a professional, or buy a whole new laptop.

    But even if you do, it’s just “buy laptop, install Linux”. Yes you may need to troubleshoot some driver issues if the manufacturer doesn’t target Linux, but that’s part and parcel of using Linux. If you want something that Just Works, buy a Mac (and use MacOS, not Asahi Linux on it).

    • JubilantJaguar@lemmy.worldOP
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      4 months ago

      The teardown video is available. It’s a 100-stage process involving specialized tools. I know my limits.

      But even if you do, it’s just “buy laptop, install Linux”.

      Not for less than a grand it isn’t. Not today. For reasons outlined. Go and check. The situation has changed.

      buy a Mac

      So you don’t think it’s a big deal if non-techie users without 1000 bucks to spare cannot use a computer with an OS under their control? I do.

      Disappointed with the flippancy (not to mention predictable bitterness and mockery) of the comments here. I want FOSS to succeed. I thought people here too did.

      • marighost@piefed.social
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        4 months ago

        Not for less than a grand it isn’t.

        My dad just bought a shop-standard Lenovo for $600~ and I slapped Mint on it with 0 issues.

        • frongt@lemmy.zip
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          4 months ago

          I just went on Dell’s site and found a surprising number of cheap Intel laptops that run Windows. That is, not Android or ChromeOS, a real full OS.

          Only the premium ones support Linux out of the box, but I’ve had very few issues with Linux on Dells at work. At home I have one of the newer cheap Thinkpads, and it had no issues with Debian. I think OP is trolling, because nothing they’re saying lines up with reality, and they’re changing their story in almost every comment.

          • JubilantJaguar@lemmy.worldOP
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            4 months ago

            Why would you make accusations like this? I don’t get the meanness of spirit of people on social media, I just don’t. Why is it so hard to accept that somebody would write a post stating their experiences and observations and not have some kind of dark ulterior motive? I just do not get it.

            Actually, having read your first paragraph I went to Dell’s site and I was just about to offer some comments, but now I see the second, full of insult and calumny, and I find I don’t have the energy to bother.